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Deschain
Joined: 15 Dec 2006 Posts: 2137 Location: Austin, TX
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Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 4:59 pm Post subject: |
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GregoryZero wrote: | StXDragonSword wrote: | Danny ruined the series.........lol |
In a way he did. He demolished the incredibly hard songs and ended up eliminating the competition from them. What would normally take probably like a few months for an ordinary awesome player would take Danny a day, if that. |
If I had to list the 3 hardest songs in the GH series, it would be Jordan, TTFAF, and DWDTG. He was the first to FC only one of those songs, and not just because he was late to the party. He was not the first to FC the entire series, or even game. He's not even 1st place on a bunch of songs. I don't hear whining about Iamchris ruining gh2 because he was the 1st to FC a Face-Melter tier song, or Freebird, or krim/ES for hitting 12 mil GH1 career score, or even Razzmatazz for FCing RB2 guitar on like day two of release.
Trying to attribute the decline/death of a series to not only one aspect, but one player of the series is spiteful, ridiculous, and petty. _________________
Fraggle Rock
Lars Ulrich said, not wrote: | It's only 7 1/2 minutes! F***, we gotta put some more riffs in there. |
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voidedalive2x
Joined: 29 May 2008 Posts: 7922 Location: jefferson city, MO
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Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 5:15 pm Post subject: |
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You forgot FCing PWM within a day of 80s coming out.
While it can't be denied that some drive is gone because of that (namely, the drive to be the first to FC a song), Deschain's right in that Danny's not the cause of the decline. A cause, maybe (but that's only for us ) _________________
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zsjostrom35
Joined: 17 Feb 2008 Posts: 2130 Location: Columbus, Ohio
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Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 5:19 pm Post subject: |
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Deschain wrote: | If I had to list the 3 hardest songs in the GH series, it would be Jordan, TTFAF, and DWDTG. He was the first to FC only one of those songs, and not just because he was late to the party. He was not the first to FC the entire series, or even game. He's not even 1st place on a bunch of songs. I don't hear whining about Iamchris ruining gh2 because he was the 1st to FC a Face-Melter tier song, or Freebird, or krim/ES for hitting 12 mil GH1 career score, or even Razzmatazz for FCing RB2 guitar on like day two of release. |
It's not about what he did, it's about how fast he did most of it. Honestly, I really don't think Danny's FCing of Devil was a main sticking point for most people; that song had been out for quite a while by the time he took it down, and the general community response to it was overwhelmingly positive in the sense that "Hey, this was the hardest song any Guitar Hero creator had ever dared throw at us, and WE FCED IT." The "we" there is important, because back then people viewed FGFCs as community projects rather than just as individual races (because almost nobody could FC a full game solo). Thus there was no resentment toward Chris/Krim/ES because they were contributing to a community project and they did it very well.
The real point where all this changed, I believe, was when Metallica came out. People were looking forward to a good challenge for the community to get a FGFC (since WT had taken MUCH less time to FGFC than any other major release to that point), but that didn't happen. Instead, Danny murdered the game in two days. Same thing with Smash Hits--the new TtFaF chart is considered by many to be at least comparably hard to the old one, yet Danny took down that game in about a week. Stuff like that absolutely killed the sense of community as far as FGFCs were concerned, and I feel that that attitude eventually trickled down to a lot of people who weren't even factors in FGFC projects. When some people complain about ScoreHero just feeling "different" than it used to, I think this may be a part of what they're talking about.
Let me be perfectly frank here: I don't blame Danny for this in the slightest. He just happened to be the best player in the world at a time when Neversoft started making the games easier, and so he got the target painted on him for an outcome that was probably inevitable anyway. Granted, he didn't help matters much by not really being a member of the community in the first place, but the fact remains that people here were just getting too good. If Danny hadn't done it when he did, it would have only been a couple more months I think before guys like oddballzfrank would have stepped in.
Deschain wrote: | Trying to attribute the decline/death of a series to not only one aspect, but one player of the series is spiteful, ridiculous, and petty. |
Agreed, but like I said above, Danny was the player with the highest profile at the time when a fundamental shift in GH attitudes was taking place that eventually left ScoreHero worse off. It's not fair that he gets so much blame for this, but it's understandable why people think that way. _________________
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jdamillio
Joined: 17 Oct 2007 Posts: 1041 Location: Philadelphia
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Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 5:31 pm Post subject: |
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STOP WITH THE DANNY RUINING THE SERIES SHIT!!! its not him, EVERYONE is too good at this game now. developers arent giving SH the omglol difficult songs we want, instead they go mainstream with the popular songs. its all about the money now, not what we want _________________
3 Finger Fretter
First ever TTFAF FC with 3 Fingers, 8/19/10 - Never Forget
GH3X: 9th Place - 69/70 FCs (One)
- Youtube: joedamillio |
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viper565
Joined: 27 May 2007 Posts: 409 Location: Des Plaines, Illinois
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Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 5:46 pm Post subject: |
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jdamillio wrote: | STOP WITH THE DANNY RUINING THE SERIES SHIT!!! its not him, EVERYONE is too good at this game now. developers arent giving SH the omglol difficult songs we want, instead they go mainstream with the popular songs. its all about the money now, not what we want |
Not necessarily. Isn't GH6 neversoft's last GH game? I think they'll just go with a bunch of real hard stuff just to cater to the hardcore crowd. 'Course I could be wrong...but I hope I'm not.
I'm not gonna comment on the Danny thing. I don't really know where I stand on that. _________________
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Thirdkoopa
Joined: 19 Jul 2008 Posts: 1041
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Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 6:03 pm Post subject: |
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I avoided posting my opinion in this thread and these type of threads for a long time but...
As most people have stated, sadly let's face it. Guitar Hero and Rock Band are "Topical" Games. Topical's die down just for being topical on there own - They get hyped, we hype em up, wars happen, chatting happens, thread dies, we start posting score's and stuff, we get analytical, we enjoy the game, we play the game.
Now that's obviously different for everyone but there's something like that in a general view to what happens. The multiple causes that happened, I.E. Massive influx of songs compared to the past are part of it. It's a small part but in the end, it's destined to happen. Topicals do that.
Of course a simple "We don't fix this." Isn't the answer - It will never be fully healed. That is the thing with a "Topical" Subject that this forum revolves around. You could apply that to anything I guess. Say there's a forum overall about music; Will it have more to discuss during 12 new albums in a month that are worth discussing or 3?
Yeah. I think you get the idea there.
The point of that was that it will never be fully healed. We won't reach peak activity of GH3 (Or we'd need a lot of luck to do that) but you know what we can do? Instead of saying "Hey, this is inactive" We should all take the initiative and try to build this as a better overall community.
How so? Mainly from what I've noticed more topics. More that brings discussion and/or debate to the table. Scared about posting a topic? Ask a moderator. Sure the rules may be a bit more strict than the official GH/RB communities but let me ask you - What's the absolute worst that will happen? They won't ban you. The staff is here (or at least should be here) to make the forum a better place overall. We need to fuel in that discussion. There's so much to discuss even when you remove the major label of "Poll threads"
What else can the site do to improve? Main notable things are keeping this site having topical interesting unofficial things as well with say, GH5 or TBRB. You could also per say get a friend here and see what they find hard to get into the site. I had a hard time getting into it myself. Think about it. What if we made a good chunk of those people who just signed up for custom's actually active? How about tournaments that stand out for say, a special rank or a prize or...I dunno.
At this point I'm honestly tossing out ideas and just rambling on and on. The point is that you can't just rely on the games itself if you guys truly want activity. Sometimes a bit of initiative and a dozen fantastic ideas can go a LONG way. Hell, in theory, GH/RB is "A bit of initiative and a dozen fantastic ideas" in a summary. To do this, we'll overall need to keep a group on that. A group that won't just quit just because their thread or idea failed . A group that is dedicated on making the place easier to get into, more of the homebase and installing it as much as possible for Scores/Competitions/Higher Players/Steam's/Signatures whatever/GH and RB more "Organized" or so per say discussion?/Customs.
If we all don't have that and work at it then let me cut it straight and simple for you: The community will always be in this cycle. Now it may not be all that bad but there's no doubt (No pun intended) that it could be better.
It won't happen overnight. It won't happen in GH3 activity, at least, not for a long time and so on. But let me remind you this - Sometimes it's not the amount of activity but it's the quality the site truly holds.
Annnnnnnd I could go on but I think I've achieved the point. _________________
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Kingofterrors
Joined: 24 Oct 2006 Posts: 1993 Location: Odenton, MD
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Posted: Mon Apr 19, 2010 7:51 am Post subject: |
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SH started it's decline when Pope stopped posting and Riz stopped owning. _________________
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tidus
Joined: 04 May 2007 Posts: 4391 Location: Anywhere but U.S.A.
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Posted: Mon Apr 19, 2010 12:14 pm Post subject: |
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It's as most people say. People buy the game, people play, have their fun, and then stuff gets worn out. Most of us actually in activity are diehard fans. Much like other games, Guitar Hero and Rock Band had their time, in my opinion, but still, there are those hardcore players playing it and keeping the activity on SH going, like on most of the cases.
Now with over 2 years of forum activity, and 2 weeks from completing 3 years since I signed up, I assumed that my fun with the pre-WT GH's would last longer than the fun with other games. In fact, it did. But there's a time when they don't get fun anymore. I've even had some friends here who used to participate on the forums, but it's been a while since they're gone. Maybe not only the game isn't fun anymore, but they have also to focus on important matters that are, say, "hungry" for free time.
Of course, for those who have the free time to keep browsing on the forums, but had their interest for GH/RB fading away, there are still other sections, as Hailz said. You can post on Music Disc., on Gaming Disc., or on General Chat, even though the latter is still the death of me, and I'm not interested on increasing my activity there myself, for personal matters. _________________
sentimentalgeek wrote: | But yeah, lol @ the fact that you can say "she" in this thread and not be sure which person is being talked about. Now we know whose milkshake brings all the girls to the yard. | <3 this.
| 57 RB1 on-disk FC's, plus 4 RB Vox FGFC's. No way I don't feel accomplished! =) |
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yakityyakblah
Joined: 08 Oct 2007 Posts: 3985
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Posted: Mon Apr 19, 2010 12:47 pm Post subject: |
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The moment a message board asks itself whether it's declined, it does. |
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buttfaceninja
Joined: 26 Aug 2006 Posts: 1567 Location: Springfield OH
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Posted: Mon Apr 19, 2010 2:11 pm Post subject: |
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Kingofterrors wrote: | SH started it's decline when Pope stopped posting and Riz stopped owning. | And when IEatGlue stopped telling stories of his yellow snowcone adventures _________________
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radoaos
Joined: 18 Feb 2007 Posts: 429 Location: Huntersville, NC
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Posted: Mon Apr 19, 2010 3:12 pm Post subject: |
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Wow, you guys didn't like my banner comment...
Here's how I see my GH/RB gaming experience.
I had a good buddy who I played with all the time, and we pushed each other to do better. His XBOX broke, and we didn't really play much together anymore. I graduated and moved, so then we REALLY didn't play much together. About that time inv4der put out banners. I thought this was cool because it gave me "something to aim for". For a month or two I worked on getting banners, but then I got bored of that.
So now, I just don't play as much as I used to. I still throw it in every now and then to rock out some, but I've been busy with other things. Things that actually make a real world difference. (job, exams, wedding planning...)
I loved playing this game, and I'm on this site a lot in the gaming discussions and general chat. After 3 years though, I'm just kind of wearing out of GH/RB.
Hope this didn't offend anyone, I just wanted yall to see where I was coming from. _________________
no longer playing RB/GH... |
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codemann8
Joined: 10 Apr 2007 Posts: 1048 Location: Oshkosh, WI
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Posted: Mon Apr 19, 2010 4:13 pm Post subject: |
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A lot of things contributed to the decline in activity. I think the biggest reason was the enormous making of GH games. Smash Hits, Metallica, GH5, Band Hero, and Van Halen...just to name a few, are all games released in 2009 alone. During this time period, I myself was a GH-aholic. Even then, I found it hard to keep up with all the new games. On top of that, keeping up with all the DLC was a joke as well.
It was because of this I don't play much GH anymore. With my working on PathHero, it has been tough to keep up, I still don't have BandHero or TBRB charts up on the site. Not for a lack of trying but theres just too much of it.
I think Activision made a wrong move by trying to make a lot of money all at once instead of smoothly spacing it out across time and making it an overall everlasting game. Now I think people have played it too much and got sick of it.
This is why Nintendo has succeeded time and time again. You ever wonder why its hard to buy a Wii at a retail store. They'll usually only get in 1 or 2 per shipment. Is it because Nintendo can't afford to make a bunch of Wiis?...no. Its because by doing so, Wiis become less common than a X360 and PS3. But with something becoming less common, it becomes more appreciated and better valued, leading to a good economy to a product and lasts so much longer. Activision failed.
Besides my rant...sigh...I still have my love for the game, and I agree, it peaked at the release of GH3. Then when GHWT came out, leagues began to fail. Leagues were an essential part of ScoreHero. But with the combination of instruments that got added into the mix, it just led to the death of leagues. I myself tried to revive the idea (LeagueHero), but no one (ok well some, but not enough) was around anymore to have a good league. My attempt was a soft mellow disappointment. _________________
Frets and Fireworks GH:A Expert Tourney Winner
AAA-2 Season 5 Overall Points Champ & Playoff Runner-Up!!!
My FCs
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GuitarGeek08
Joined: 19 Jan 2008 Posts: 3213
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Posted: Mon Apr 19, 2010 4:28 pm Post subject: |
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I think SH really began to decline when it shifted all of the focus to Rhythm Authors. Ever since it started, it feels like no one is on here anymore, and up until then it had been bustling. Secondly, what is there to discuss on here? Most of general chat topics are locked up under the rules of the forum....
Now what can be done to fix this? Well, I think activity needs to be opened up more to include other games. I think this will really up activity, especially w GHs inevitable decline from oversaturation. There are plenty of games that could be tracked, and the April Fools Joke of FF13 shows potential.
A revival of the banner thread for other videogames would help with this greatly. It provides a way to reward accomplishments for other games, and would also help to motivate an increase in activity. I know it would help me, since I myself have not been very active as of late. _________________
I Don't Suck at GH
Xpertlefty13 quoting me in his Acc Thread wrote: | Honestly, thank you
This is the first real, well thought-out explanation I've seen |
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StXDragonSword
Joined: 07 Jun 2007 Posts: 451
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Posted: Mon Apr 19, 2010 5:23 pm Post subject: |
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zsjostrom35 wrote: | Deschain wrote: | If I had to list the 3 hardest songs in the GH series, it would be Jordan, TTFAF, and DWDTG. He was the first to FC only one of those songs, and not just because he was late to the party. He was not the first to FC the entire series, or even game. He's not even 1st place on a bunch of songs. I don't hear whining about Iamchris ruining gh2 because he was the 1st to FC a Face-Melter tier song, or Freebird, or krim/ES for hitting 12 mil GH1 career score, or even Razzmatazz for FCing RB2 guitar on like day two of release. |
It's not about what he did, it's about how fast he did most of it. Honestly, I really don't think Danny's FCing of Devil was a main sticking point for most people; that song had been out for quite a while by the time he took it down, and the general community response to it was overwhelmingly positive in the sense that "Hey, this was the hardest song any Guitar Hero creator had ever dared throw at us, and WE FCED IT." The "we" there is important, because back then people viewed FGFCs as community projects rather than just as individual races (because almost nobody could FC a full game solo). Thus there was no resentment toward Chris/Krim/ES because they were contributing to a community project and they did it very well.
The real point where all this changed, I believe, was when Metallica came out. People were looking forward to a good challenge for the community to get a FGFC (since WT had taken MUCH less time to FGFC than any other major release to that point), but that didn't happen. Instead, Danny murdered the game in two days. Same thing with Smash Hits--the new TtFaF chart is considered by many to be at least comparably hard to the old one, yet Danny took down that game in about a week. Stuff like that absolutely killed the sense of community as far as FGFCs were concerned, and I feel that that attitude eventually trickled down to a lot of people who weren't even factors in FGFC projects. When some people complain about ScoreHero just feeling "different" than it used to, I think this may be a part of what they're talking about.
Let me be perfectly frank here: I don't blame Danny for this in the slightest. He just happened to be the best player in the world at a time when Neversoft started making the games easier, and so he got the target painted on him for an outcome that was probably inevitable anyway. Granted, he didn't help matters much by not really being a member of the community in the first place, but the fact remains that people here were just getting too good. If Danny hadn't done it when he did, it would have only been a couple more months I think before guys like oddballzfrank would have stepped in.
Deschain wrote: | Trying to attribute the decline/death of a series to not only one aspect, but one player of the series is spiteful, ridiculous, and petty. |
Agreed, but like I said above, Danny was the player with the highest profile at the time when a fundamental shift in GH attitudes was taking place that eventually left ScoreHero worse off. It's not fair that he gets so much blame for this, but it's understandable why people think that way. |
long post but I enjoyed reading it and pretty much agreed with it all
quick question here so Danny never really became part of the community? It was just apparent to me now after watching more of recent videos, its just his Ego looks like it just takes over him and his attitude looks like he just always think hes the best at everything he does....don't get me wrong is a hell of a guitarist, and plastic instruments but I hate when people get to much into themselves.
Correct me if I am wrong but does anyone else feel this way? _________________
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toymachine
Joined: 30 Oct 2006 Posts: 9629 Location: Toronto
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Posted: Mon Apr 19, 2010 5:32 pm Post subject: |
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Danny may have already FCd dis song
but Oddballzfrank already FCd dat game _________________
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